{"id":1308,"date":"2019-08-04T01:21:06","date_gmt":"2019-08-04T05:21:06","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/?p=1308"},"modified":"2019-08-10T17:36:17","modified_gmt":"2019-08-10T21:36:17","slug":"you-o-mary-our-dear-lady","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/you-o-mary-our-dear-lady\/","title":{"rendered":"You, O Mary, our dear Lady"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>This is the LAST of the Marian hymns we will be looking at for the proposed hymnal &#8211; and Some Changes Have Been Made. Read below to find out why!<\/p>\n<p><!--more--><\/p>\n<h2 align=\"left\">Discussion<\/h2>\n<p>This song to the Mother of God (<em>Ty, Marije, na\u0161a Panna<\/em>) has been around for more than a century.\u00a0 Here is the version in the 1969 collection, <em>Duchovni Pisni:<\/em><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_Papp.gif\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"size-full wp-image-1309 aligncenter\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_Papp.gif\" alt=\"\" width=\"460\" height=\"248\" \/><\/a>It is in a regular 4\/4 time, with no particular syncopation or other trickiness.<\/p>\n<p>And here is the version in the <em>Marian Hymnal <\/em>(1984):<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-1310\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"701\" height=\"601\" srcset=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984.jpg 701w, https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984-300x257.jpg 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 709px) 85vw, (max-width: 909px) 67vw, (max-width: 984px) 61vw, (max-width: 1362px) 45vw, 600px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p align=\"left\">The duple meter (1, 2, 1, 2) of the Papp version has become triple (1, 2,\u00a0 3, 1, 2, 3), with two different patterns:<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\">An accented SHORT note followed by an unaccented long note (called the Lombard rhythm, or Scotch snap):<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\"><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_1.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"size-full wp-image-1311 aligncenter\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_1.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"265\" height=\"94\" \/><\/a>and an accented LONG note followed by unaccented short notes:<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\"><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_2.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-1312\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_2.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"554\" height=\"106\" srcset=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_2.jpg 554w, https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna_1984_2-300x57.jpg 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 554px) 85vw, 554px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p align=\"left\">The problem is that many cantor continued to sing at least part of the hymn with the older, simpler 4\/4 pattern, only switching to triple meter when the English made anything else impossible:<\/p>\n<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\" align=\"left\">You COM-fort US with YOUR mer-CY.<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\">After a lot of experimentation and work with groups of cantors, I&#8217;ve decided NOT to use the more complicated rhythm in the <em>Marian<\/em> <em>Hymnal,<\/em> but to return instead to something more like the Papp setting.\u00a0 Here is the English:<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\"><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/You_O_Mary_our_dear_Lady.png\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-1313\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/You_O_Mary_our_dear_Lady.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"644\" height=\"390\" srcset=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/You_O_Mary_our_dear_Lady.png 644w, https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/You_O_Mary_our_dear_Lady-300x182.png 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 709px) 85vw, (max-width: 909px) 67vw, (max-width: 984px) 61vw, (max-width: 1362px) 45vw, 600px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p align=\"left\">And here is the Slavonic:<\/p>\n<p align=\"left\"><a href=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna.png\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-1314\" src=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"646\" height=\"386\" srcset=\"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna.png 646w, https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/08\/Ty_Marije_nasa_Panna-300x179.png 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 709px) 85vw, (max-width: 909px) 67vw, (max-width: 984px) 61vw, (max-width: 1362px) 45vw, 600px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>Cantor who WANT to experiment with triple rhythm\u00a0 can still do so, but cantors who try to sing it as written will have a much easier time.<\/p>\n<h2>One text change<\/h2>\n<p>There IS one bad accent in the English that always cropped up, though, when the simpler 4\/4 rhythm was used:<\/p>\n<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\"><strong>O<\/strong> most <strong>ho<\/strong>ly <strong>di<\/strong>vine <strong>Mo<\/strong>ther&#8230;.<\/p>\n<p>with an accent on the &#8220;DI&#8221; of &#8220;divine.&#8221;\u00a0 What made it worse is that very often, those coming into our churches heard us call Mary our &#8220;divine Mother&#8221; and suspected their worst fears were true: we DID worship Mary as a goddess! (Hint: Mary is not divine.)<\/p>\n<p>So in the proposed setting, I resolved both problems by changing the line to:<\/p>\n<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">O most holy, God&#8217;s own mother<\/p>\n<p>If you have a better selection, please send it in!<\/p>\n<p><strong>&#8212; EDIT, August 10:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Cantor Joseph Ferenchick of the Inter-Eparchial Music Commission suggested:<\/p>\n<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">O most holy Theotokos,<\/p>\n<p>which I must admit is clearer.\u00a0 I intend to use that for now.<\/p>\n<h2 align=\"left\">Thoughts or suggestions?<\/h2>\n<p>Please leave a comment!<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>This is the LAST of the Marian hymns we will be looking at for the proposed hymnal &#8211; and Some Changes Have Been Made. Read below to find out why!<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"episode_type":"","audio_file":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"","filesize":"","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":"","itunes_episode_number":"","itunes_title":"","itunes_season_number":"","itunes_episode_type":"","filesize_raw":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[25],"tags":[20],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1308"}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=1308"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1308\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1317,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1308\/revisions\/1317"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=1308"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=1308"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mci.archpitt.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=1308"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}